An interview with Nanami Kamon, the director of the 'Onmyoji 0' movie's Jujutsu Kaisen production: 'Jujutsu Kaisen has become entertainment that adults can enjoy too'
The film ' Onmyoji 0 ', which has been receiving rave reviews since its release on April 19, 2024, is directed by Tsumako Sato, a big fan of the original novel 'Onmyoji' and a man who has been hoping to turn it into a film for many years. She poured all her passion into the film. The persuasiveness of the film is created by various aspects such as the acting, art, and music, but one aspect that definitely plays a part is the 'magic' used by the main character Abe no Seimei and his friends, and in this film, the magic is supervised by
If we were to simply say 'charms,' it would be a fairly common thing, but I had the opportunity to speak to Kamon directly about who he is, the man who brings realism to the 'magic' that we seem to know but don't, so I asked him the things that caught my attention.
Official website for the movie 'Onmyoji 0' | Now showing and a huge hit!
https://wwws.warnerbros.co.jp/onmyoji0/
Kamon Nanami answered the interview questions.
©Tomoko Tominaga
GIGAZINE (hereinafter, G):
I'm going to start by asking questions that I'm curious about, so I'm sorry for starting with a strange question. In
'Onmyoji 0' movie supervision, Nanami Kamon (hereinafter, Kamon):
The ogres are not the bad guys. They are not the ones who get beaten. For example, in 'Momotaro,' the ogres are treated as villains for no reason, and then the ogres are defeated, their property is stolen, and everyone splits it among themselves. It makes Momotaro seem like some kind of invader.
G:
(lol)
Kamon:
There's no personality to the demons. I think even demons have parents and children. In this way, in fairy tales, demons are often thought of as bad, but in 'The Red Demon Who Cried' the perception is completely different. When you think about it, the basis of this may have been the perspective of the discriminated. The heartwarming friendship of one person sacrificing the other in order to somehow blend into human society is also heartbreaking.
G:
In the same interview, you mentioned an interesting story about three things you should be careful of when creating your own work: 'Oni,' 'Prince Shotoku,' and 'Northern and Southern Courts.' If you handle them improperly, it can be a disaster. Is this a story you've heard somewhere before?
Kamon:
I think this is a good summary of the things around me.
G:
Huh...?
Kamon:
There are writers and researchers who have tackled this subject, but most of them end up giving up midway through, due to physical reasons.
G:
Physical!
Kamon:
For example, while I was writing, the shelves on both sides of my desk fell down even though there was no earthquake and I was about to be crushed, or I was mentally cornered, and even though I kept saying that I was going to write, I gradually stopped listening to them, and then I disappeared... I have written a book about 'demons' before, but at the time I wrote it with the thought that 'If I write from the demons' side with love, I think something will work out.' However, I don't think such feelings will work for 'Prince Shotoku' or 'The Northern and Southern Courts.' There are a lot of books on historical research being published now, but they are able to be published safely because they are off the mark, and it is said that if they write the truth, they will disappear.
G:
So that's true. Well, in this work 'Onmyoji 0', 'magic' appears as an important element of the work, but in an interview with Da Vinci , when Kamon was asked 'Are charms effective?' he answered 'I think so,' and gave as examples the five-pointed star 'Seman' and the lattice-patterned 'Doman' talismans worn by female divers in Ise. They are said to be derived from Abe no Seimei and Ashiya Doman, respectively, but why are they called Seman and Doman, respectively?
Abe no Seimei uses 'magic' in the movie 'Onmyoji 0'
Kamon:
First of all, the pentagram is used in the crest of the Seimei Shrine, and it is also the name of the pattern,
G:
That's right.
Kamon:
On the other hand, the nine-character lattice pattern 'Doman' came to be compared to 'Seman Doman' after Abe no Seimei and Ashiya Doman were depicted in contrast to each other in Kabuki and other plays. However, there is no story that Ashiya Doman used the nine-character pattern as his own symbol.
As a purely contrasting feature, first there was the five-pointed Seman, a powerful talisman, and then there was the kuji-kiri form performed by mountain ascetics, so I interpret this as meaning 'If there is Seimei, there must be Doman too,' and so it became 'Doman.'
G:
I see, that makes sense. Another very interesting article about Kamon-san was a column written by the editor in charge of the 2008 edition of ' Kai no Hanashi ' in Shueisha's 'Renzabro,' which mentioned that Kamon-san had been scouted by shrine maidens, and that she had been told secrets by people she interviewed because 'she has studied hard.' Does this happen often?
Kamon:
There are parts of it that are true, and parts that the editor has exaggerated a little bit (laughs).
G:
(lol)
Kamon:
However, when I was covering shrines and temples and listening to their stories, the Aum Shinrikyo incident had just happened, and the public was feeling increasingly wary of religious things. The term 'power spot' didn't even exist back then, so even if you went to a shrine, you would be asked, 'Are you doing some kind of religion?'
G:
What...
Kamon:
If you pray at a temple, you'll be told, 'You're so enthusiastic,' and if you say you went to a shrine on top of a mountain, you'll be asked, 'Why did you go to a place like that that has nothing?' That's the kind of era it was. So, if you study hard, the people there are very happy, and there were certainly times when they would ask you, 'If you have that much knowledge, how about becoming our shrine maiden?' It's a difference in the historical context, isn't it?
G:
So that's how it was. This time, Kamon-san participated in 'Onmyoji 0' as a jujutsu supervisor, and Director Sato commented, ' It was my long-cherished wish to welcome Kamon Nanami, a leading figure in the jujutsu world .' So, if you want to know more about jujutsu now, is it best to ask Kamon-san? Or, from your perspective, is there anyone who knows more about it?
Kamon:
There are so many people who have done the same thing, so at first I wondered, 'Why me?' However, now that I have been involved in the production, I think that there are probably some things that religious people or scholars would not be able to produce, and some parts that would be difficult to accommodate. Since I am also involved in creative activities myself, I think I was able to give appropriate leeway and make adjustments, thinking, 'Here, it would be okay to make this much adjustment,' and I think they were able to see my suitability.
G:
In an interview published on cinemacafe.net, Kamon said, ' People are drawn to what they want to believe and see. Many people believe articles that pretend to be fair and public. If you add even a little suggestion to that, it becomes a full-fledged 'curse.'' He described modern fake news as a kind of sorcery. Has there been anything recently that made you think, 'This is sorcerous fake news'?
Kamon:
This is the trailer for 'Onmyoji 0'!
Movie 'Onmyoji 0' official trailer released on Friday, April 19, 2024 - YouTube
G:
(lol)
Kamon:
As expected from video professionals, they are good at presenting things. As you watch, you combine things in your mind, such as Hiromasa's 'It's over!' or the clash between the water dragon and the fire dragon, and you interpret them in a way that suits you. It's like witnessing the seeds of misconceptions that are manipulated by fakes.
From the movie 'Onmyoji 0,' Minamoto Hiromasa, who will encounter various difficulties together with Abe no Seimei
G:
It's true that the movie trailer has some parts that are well connected to the main story. By the way, the movie 'Onmyoji 0' also explained the structure of the Onmyoryo and the country's Onmyoji, but when I looked at Kamon's SNS, there was a story about 'self-proclaimed Onmyoji' . Are there still people who call themselves Onmyoji?
Kamon:
There are people who call themselves onmyoji and work as such.
G:
Does this mean that people who have no connection to onmyoji are calling themselves 'onmyoji'?
Kamon:
It's a difficult question. There are no onmyoji with a civil servant-like license anymore, but private onmyoji have a long history, and if they are related to them, there is no blame. For public onmyoji, the system is that at the top is the Ministry of Central Affairs, and below that is the Onmyoryo, and each onmyoji is there. But that kind of organization doesn't exist anymore. In modern terms, it's like having the National Tax Agency, below that are tax offices, and tax officials, so it's not right to say 'I'm from the tax office' if you're not an employee.
G:
Aaah...
Abe no Seimei as a student at the Onmyou-ryo from the movie 'Onmyoji 0'
Kamon:
If someone were to introduce themselves as a public official and say, 'I'm from the tax office,' I think that would be fraudulent. But if they were to say, 'I know a lot about accounting, so let me take a look,' then I don't think that would be fraud.
G:
Similarly, on Kamon's X, there was a post saying, 'Some people say that the modern Onmyouryo is the Japan Meteorological Agency, but it's actually the Japan Coast Guard.' In 'Onmyoji 0,' Koremune Korekuni appears as an astronomy expert in the Onmyouryo, but what does it mean that it's the Japan Coast Guard and not the Japan Meteorological Agency?
Kamon:
The Onmyo-ryo was the department that handled astronomy and calendars. Astronomy is basically the observation of celestial bodies, which is what the Japan Coast Guard is best at. As with the Japan Meteorological Agency, it was the Japan Coast Guard that had long provided calendar information derived from star observations, so historically speaking, it was meant to be the successor to the Japan Coast Guard.
No. Some people say that the modern Onmyo-ryo is the Japan Meteorological Agency, but it's actually the Japan Coast Guard.
https://t.co/pFhzmjV1Q0 — Nanami Kamon (@kamonnanami) January 20, 2024
The 'astronomical calendar' published by this company was used to make commercially available calendars. Unfortunately, it ended last year, but it contained a huge amount of information.
So I think someone from the 'Japan Coast Guard Yin Yang Division' should write a story.
G:
Onmyoji is a real profession, but were the real onmyoji close to the way they are depicted in the movie 'Onmyoji 0'? Or, since it's a movie, are there some parts where they are portrayed differently?
Kamon:
That's right... In the world of creative writing, onmyoji have always been superstars.
G:
(lol)
Kamon:
I think that the onmyoji depicted as superstars in such works of fiction and the onmyoji who actually practiced onmyodo in history should not be mixed together. The movie is entertainment after all, and I think that the original novel 'Onmyoji' by Baku Yumemakura draws on the image of Abe no Seimei that appears in the Konjaku Monogatari and other works. I think that the movie 'Onmyoji 0' is a continuation of the lineage that continues from the collection of tales.
G:
I think 'Onmyoji 0' is a work that will spark your interest in onmyoji itself. When that happens, the original novel by Baku Yumemakura is the most familiar to you, but are there any other works that you know that you would recommend to people who are interested in onmyoji?
Kamon:
There are so many manga and novels about onmyoji and jujutsu these days... Also, people's tastes are very diversified, some people like battle stuff, some people like female characters (laughs).
G:
(lol)
Kamon:
There are many works that feature onmyoji, so I think you have plenty of options to choose your favorite onmyoji, so I think it's best to just find one that you like.
The movie 'Onmyoji 0' depicts the time when Abe no Seimei and Minamoto no Hiromasa first met.
G:
I see (laughs) What were your honest thoughts now that you've seen the final product?
Kamon:
Frankly, all I can say is 'amazing.' I had read the script, so I knew the story in my head, but when I saw the whole thing, I was amazed at how well it was connected, how it was presented as a visual image, and how realistic the story was made to feel through sight and sound.
G:
Finally, I would like to ask you about your career. After graduating from Tama Art University Graduate School, you worked as a curator at an art museum before making your debut as an artist. In a past interview, you mentioned that when you were a junior high school student, there was a boom in UFOs and pyramid power, and although you felt sympathy for it, in junior high and high school you felt repulsed by the many people who flatly denied that such things existed. However, as an artist you create works that evoke the image of demons and sorcery, so I was curious as to why you decided to study art.
Kamon:
As with 'Onmyoji 0,' art can be very symbolic, and there are many works that express the spiritual world, so even though I didn't pursue painting, I feel there is a connection between the two.
G:
I read that when he made his debut as a writer, he wanted to make a living writing youth fantasy action novels.
Kamon:
Nowadays, we can talk openly about ghost stories or sorcery, but similar to the story of the shrine maiden I mentioned earlier, in the past they were not considered something that adults read.
G:
That too is a matter of the times...
Kamon:
Nowadays, there are works like ' Jujutsu Kaisen ' that are global hits, and magic has become entertainment that adults can enjoy. I think that being involved in 'Onmyoji 0' this time has also become a logical job that is connected to my life.
G:
Although the interview included some questions that were not particularly related to the work, thank you for sharing so much with us.
Kamon:
thank you very much.
The movie 'Onmyoji 0' is currently a huge hit. On May 9, 2024, a stage greeting to thank fans for the hit will be held at Marunouchi Piccadilly 1, with Yamazaki Kento, who plays Abe no Seimei, Sometani Shota, who plays Minamoto no Hiromasa, Itagaki Rihito, who plays Emperor Murakami, and Sato Tsumako, the director, scheduled to appear on stage.
Special episode 0 of the movie 'Onmyoji 0' ~The Secret of Magic~ is now showing and is a huge hit! - YouTube
◆ 'Onmyoji 0' work information
Cast: Kento Yamazaki, Shota Sometani, Nao, Masanobu Ando, Nijiro Murakami, Rihito Itagaki, Jun Kunimura, Kazuki Kitamura, Kaoru Kobayashi
Original work: Baku Yumemakura's 'Onmyoji' series (Bungeishunju)
Screenplay and Director: Tsumako Sato
Music: Naoki Sato
Theme song: BUMP OF CHICKEN 'Encounter' (TOY'S FACTORY)
Magic Supervision: Nanami Kamon
Distributor: Warner Bros. Pictures
©2024映画「陰陽師0」製作委員会
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